Linguaphiles

check my French?

Thu, 23 May 2013 20:54:14 GMT

Hi! If anyone has a few minutes, would you look at these sentences and tell me if my scanty French has produced grammatically acceptable, non-bizarre sentences? Do you have any alternate suggestions, especially colloquial turns of phrase, not too youthfully slangy?

Thank you very much.

Sois pas triste, mon cher.

Suis-moi. Martine va a chercher un peu de gâteau.

Je vais te laisser ici tout le seul, si tu te calmes pas.

Ressaisis-toi, mon poulet.

Tais-toi, lapin.

Honte à toi. Comment oses-tu?

Chut! Pas de bruit.

Ne fais pas de foin! (I understand this might be a colloquial expression meaning "don't make a fuss." Would it be generally understood?)

Chut, sois brave.

Lâche-moi, tu sale bête! Tu sale chien!

Accent learning and keeping it going.

Thu, 23 May 2013 10:45:38 GMT

Hi everyone! So this might be a bit of a fun one. There's also a bit of storytelling so I've put everything under a cut. It's basically about my experience trying to pick up and internalise a new accent.

So, the gist of it. I was born in Hong Kong but spent most of my life being educated in Singapore (my dad moved when I was barely a year old). As a result, I've largely spoken English with a fairly obviously Singaporean accent, but it's rather toned down because i) it's not what I speak at home and ii) the extent of influence from generically British or American forms of speech is greater the further up the education spectrum you go.

I've always been largely good with accents in general, but that was usually when I did impressions or was just mucking about with my friends. Two years ago I came over to London for university and, with a British passport in hand (thank you, Hong Kong), I figured that this was my chance to maybe really sort out what I wanted to do with the rest of my life. My primary aim became assimilation, and a few months in I realised that I really wanted to give serious theatre work a shot. Whatever I might end up doing, my mind was set on assimilation, and I set myself the task of paying very close attention to how my cousins, who were born and raised here in London, spoke, and to see if I could gradually ease myself in. I would watch shows and repeat lines to myself, listen out on the Underground or at uni to the way people spoke, and basically just bounce off other people.

Two years on, I've had some very interesting results and experiences. I suspect that I now speak with a broadly Southeast English accent -- 'suspect', because I'm trying not to be overly self-conscious about it -- but I realised that there were a number of words I never really learnt to properly pronounce ('vinyl' and 'cameo' are among them). A mate from church pointed it out to me a couple of weeks ago but he thought it was merely a regional difference (I don't think it is). Those realisations aside, though, I've found myself having some fairly mixed responses about it: during the early stages of learning, some people thought I was from the States — but most of them weren't actually English, and the usual assumption about an East Asian person speaking good English is that he/she is from America ... I don't even know. Over time, though, more people I met generally just didn't really think twice about the way I spoke, and/or they would just assume that I was from somewhere around the area. On the other hand, while I largely feel okay and quite confident about talking sometimes (and I don't really notice that I'm speaking any differently though I *am* speaking very differently from before I came here), there are days when I feel like my tongue is winding up and my lips are losing control and I can't seem to speak properly. No one else really notices but on those days I get a bit more self-conscious. Also, I recently started paying attention to English accents outside of Southeast England (it's hard not to), but the trade-off appears to be that because my mind seems to draw on what it knows, I get the suspicion that I very occasionally lapse for a handful of words into a pitching that might or might not be somewhat northern.

So, the point of this post: I thought I'd share my experience with trying to move from a non-standard English accent to a mainstream accent for assimilation and the sort of results I've been getting along the way. Has anyone experienced similar things to what I've mentioned, or have things been different, and what are some of the methods that you've found to be helpful to keeping things going and other tips or ideas in general? I'm interested primarily in English here, but if you have experiences in other languages with moving from a 'foreign' accent into a regional one, do share as well!

P.S. I know there are people in the world who consider such accent-learning behaviour 'pretentious' or 'inauthentic', but the whole point of this post isn't to judge such matters. Please don't turn this post into something negative like that.

a random question

Thu, 23 May 2013 02:59:48 GMT

Quite a few times lately I've come across a certain use of "random" that sounds rather unusual to me.

(1) When studying math and English, one gets a pretty good idea of what "random" means. So "random acts of violence" (or kindness, no less dangerous according to Wodehouse), or even "let's go do something random and enjoy ourselves" sound normal

(2) But then there is another pattern. Someone comes to a group of young men and says something awkward, sounding more geeky than he'd probably wished. After the man leaves, everyone guffaws (or sniggers as the case may be): "man, that was random" or "he was so random", almost as a synonym to "weird".

Dictionaries are not of much help here, nor my copy of a small corpus of English - so I have to ask the question here:
-- how would you define the meaning of "random" in the second example?
-- Is it new?
-- is it an Americanism?
-- and/or what age groups are more likely to say sth like (2)?

.. or am I getting it wrong and the second use of "random" is absolutely standard and indistinguishable from (1) in the mind of a native speaker?

Language Exchanges

Wed, 22 May 2013 00:06:58 GMT

Has anyone in this community ever had an (in-person, not penpal) language exchange partner?

If so, what was your experience like and do you have any tips?

I'm currently living in Korea, and this is my third year here. Since I've been here so long, I've started to study the local language more seriously. I began just a few months ago and my level is very low. My goal is basically to be conversational.

I take a weekly free class but am starting to meet partners to help me practice.

The big problem I have is that Koreans, on average, have been studying my language for years on end obsessively, while I'm only a beginner in their language. It makes it much easier them to push English. (Related note, this past weekend I went to a "language exchange" meeting, only to find everyone, including other expats, only speaking English.) So, I feel like I have to be careful to make sure they're not the only ones benefiting from the "exchange." Anyone ever been in this situation?

Japanese translation!

Tue, 21 May 2013 09:26:41 GMT

Hello everybody!

I don't understand this passage very well (It's difficult to read! D:)

The passage in bracket says "空を天じょうから吊るしている糸"? (like "From the deep sky a hanging thread"?) I'm not sure of this!

Can you help me?? Thank you so much!

Just a question

Mon, 20 May 2013 14:17:16 GMT

Hi everybody.

There is a little problem in understanding the following passage typed bold.

Why and what was the proviso in the writer's mind, if the writer agreed with the famous surgeon?

[q]A well-known brilliant surgeon in Dublin who excelled in most out-of-the-way, venturesome operations, spoke very slightingly to me years ago of the uselessness of medicines. "They are all rubbish and should be thown overboard, with the exception of perhaps one or two pain-killing drugs. You don't believe in medicines, do you?" he turned to me, then the young tyro just fresh from the schools. I suppose he saw the faintly doubting expression on my face. "Oh, no," I quickly replied, with a proviso in my mind--it would not do to offend the great man. Certainly I did not believe in the efficacy of the medicines, as I had seen them applied in the wards of the famous hospital, where I was trained.[/q]

Thank you in advance.

japanese homework help

Sun, 19 May 2013 19:55:59 GMT

Hi all, hope your language studies are going well! I'm trying to give myself homework regularly for Japanese, I know, such a nerd = P anyway...

1. I try to say ‘I hear that’ along the lines of...’I hear that Japan has beautiful scenery.’ Would it be right to say this:

‘Tonokoto desu ( I hear that ) Nihon-ni, utsukushii keshiki arimasu.
Or, should I say, Nihon-ni, utsukushii keshiki arimasu, to kikimasu.

2. The family terms still confuse me a little as, I need to use different ones for myself versus another...so is this right, if i say for ME, I have a younger brother: Watashi-wa otooto motte imasu?

3.Then if I ask someone do they have an older sister, can I say ‘Yuki-san, onii-san motte imasu ka? By the way, older brother and sister seem the same word? Oniisan/ Oneesan?

4. I was trying to ask this question of a local today – i was curious to get their opinion on ‘lifestyle’ or daily life in Japan. I wanted to ask him does he think it’s difficult or easy:
Nihon ni, seikatsu-wa, muzukashii ka yasashii desu to omoimasu?

5.I often want to ask someone what they would recommend, like do you recommend this drink or that one. Or between these two, which one would you recommend? I have found two ways I THINK express this but again if you can correct me that would be great =)

-Dochira ga, osusume desu ka?
-Nani-ga, nomeda / tabeta ho ga ii desu ka?

So in both cases is the same meaning of ‘which would you recommend’ conveyed?

6.It seems there are many ways to indicate ‘I want something.’ Is this just another way, perhaps more formal?
_____ o moratte mo ii desu ka?

Like pan – o, keki-o moratte mo ii desu ka?
But I was thinking, if I also said ‘Keki-o, onegai shimasu’
OR ‘Keki-o, hoshii desu’ ‘Keki-o, tabetai desu’ ‘Kore-wa, kaitai desu’
Seems to me they all mean the same thing as in ‘I want this cake’ lol.

Thank you all for your help and corrections =)

French slang?

Sun, 19 May 2013 17:00:08 GMT

Super-random question, so I apologize in advance, although there is actually a reason for it. Is there a French equivalent to the "gangster/mafia" dialect that exists in English? In which ordinary words have a variety of completely off-the-wall definitions when taken in that context (ex. to clip = to kill, juice = interest on a loan, to pinch = to arrest)? If so, can someone direct me to some sort of glossary/list? If not, thank you anyway!

a little more Japanese classroom phrases

Sun, 19 May 2013 04:42:46 GMT

Thanks so much for your support and help with the ESL help / phrases! It's very helpful to use. At times there are usually one or two students who clearly have a little more difficulty than others with their English, so knowing the Japanese phrases or writing it on the board in katakana really helps them! =) Then of course I get them all to repeat my English haha.

1.~ I would like to say 'DON"T stand on the table/desk' 'Sit down' but in this context should I use the actual vocabulary word for table, or desk - I guess they are interchangeable in this sense...

Also sit down, is it 'suwatte kudasai' to be polite, and would this include talking about myself, like 'May I sit here' would that be 'Suwatte kudasai' or 'Suwatte onegai shimasu'? OR I think I must use the form of 'te' verb, plus 'mo ii desu ka' - so for ME, do I say 'Watashi wa, koko ni suwatte mo ii desu ka?'

BUT to tell a student 'Don't stand' 'Sit down' would it be the same?

2.~ I want to tell students to make sentences using vocabulary words. I have shown them the word 'sentence' in the dictionary but the process of 'to make a sentence' does not seem to register. What would you recommend to convey this better? Is there a special verb to use, when talking about grammar, and like..' to make ' a sentence, same thing ' to make ' a story?

3.~ How would you ask a student ' Can YOU teach ME? ' sometimes I think it helps their confidence, especially the weaker ones in English, if they show me with their actions for example...how to play a game or do some craft.

Can I say ' Onegai shimasu, oshiete kudasai ' like please tell me or instruct me? Or ' Kore wa, do yatte shimasu? ' ( This thing, how / in what manner do you do it? '

Thanks you all =)

Video clips with linguistics concepts

Fri, 17 May 2013 15:24:27 GMT

Hi!

I'm going to be teaching an introductory linguistics class this summer, and I'd like to introduce class sessions with short video clips illustrating various concepts. These should not be pedagogical, but rather cases of linguistics in action. For example, in the last season of the West Wing, there's a conversation between Leo McGarry and his very short publicity assistant about how to pronounce Matt Santos's last name: [sɑntos] or [sæntos], complete with a discussion of the implications of saying it wrong. This can introduce both a class on vowel transcription, and also a class on sociolinguistics. There's also that great scene from Pirates of Penzance where the entire humor rests in the fact that, in British English, "orphan" and "often" (here, starting at about 1:30: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiXSR3PQQPE) are homophonous which can introduce a discussion of mergers (also use vs. mention). And, of course, practically any scene from My Fair Lady is good for phonetics (and sociolinguistics). Do you have any scenes from films or TV shows (ideally three minutes or less) that made you think, "Golly, what a great example of [syntactic ambiguity/Gricean conversational implicature/imperfect synonyms/morphological productivity]?" It's good if they're on youtube, but I can also get them through my school's library, so don't hold back!

Thanks!

MakSim - She who runs on the waves

Mon, 13 May 2013 06:00:34 GMT

My translation of the song :)

Text:

In a distant sea,
In an unknown land,
There is a marvelous dream’s island.
The dreams come true there,
Where a wave keeps a weightless step.

I will run like a wave,
I’ll discover the island of dream,
We are to meet there,
That’s decided by fate.

I will run like a wave,
Becoming your dream.
She who runs on the waves,
Is calling you to follow her.

Let an unfettered wind
Tell about love,
And a sea wave to whisper.
Let the stars from above
Show rightly the way.

And I’ll be near and forever with you
I will run like a wave
I’ll discover the island of dream
We are to meet there
That’s decided by fate
She who runs on the waves
Is calling you to follow her.

P.S. plz don't be shy to point out the flaws :)

Arabic Translation?

Sun, 12 May 2013 15:52:18 GMT

A friend of mine (different one from the last one I posted about) got this in Konya, a conservative area of Turkey, in 1968. It is about a foot long, painted on glass. Can anyone translate?

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/bychoice/609336/441515/441515_600.jpg

Thanks in advance!

RP, posh accent

Sat, 11 May 2013 19:37:40 GMT

Hello again!

In my previous post (here) I asked your opinions on my accent. Thanks everyone for your answers! But because of some comments I'm a little bit confused. (

My teacher of English spoke RP. He was not a native speaker but he visited UK many, many times, ~~so I trusted that man! (~~. He claimed RP to be the most 'neutral' accent of all the English accents. And he also said that RP would be the best choice for a foreigner, because it is not assosiated with any specific area\region\etc.

So I do try to imitate RP when I speak English. And until now I have thought that RP does not equal a 'posh accent'.

My questions are:
if RP is considered to be 'posh' and somewhat associated with upper-classes, what accent would you call 'neutral' (which has no negative or positive connotations)?
What accent would you expect a foreigner to speak with?

Thank you!

Ah, and most of you were right about where I cme from. I'm Ukrainian, so my native languages are Ukrainian and Russian respectively.

European Spanish

Fri, 10 May 2013 23:31:03 GMT

Hello fellow linguaphiles!

Could anyone please tell me where I could find a good cost-free source for pronunciation and listening practice for European Spanish online?
Or any site that focuses on, or at least gives an equal amount of time, to the European Spanish way of writing and speaking?
Everything I come across seems to be more focused on South American accents/dialects.

Thanks so much!

Will vs. Shall

Fri, 10 May 2013 19:58:16 GMT

It often seems to me that "will" and "shall" can be used interchangeably, with only a tiny bit difference in tone. However, a friend sent me the following quote and asked about "will" vs. "shall" in it.

What warm, unspoken secrets will we learn? Beyond the point of no return.

I told him:
I think that "shall" implies that it will definitely happen.
"what shall we learn beyond the point of no return?"
"what will we learn beyond the point of no return?"
The best way I can explain this is that in the second one, with "will", he is holding out his hand to someone, implying "if you come with me". In the first one, the listener has taken his hand, and it implies "when you come with me."

What do the rest of you think of using "will" or "shall" in this quote? Would the meaning or flavor change? Also, if I'm totally wrong about the use of "shall" please let me know. Thanks!

how to write classroom rules for students in Japanese.

Fri, 10 May 2013 17:00:07 GMT

( note - xposted to linguaphiles )

Okay, I think if I can do this correctly and have students understand, I'll meet with better experiences as I'm teaching.

I'd so appreciate the correct way to write this - I think these kids know all hiragana, katakana and tons of kanji, but perhaps hiragana is the best for them to read quickly and understand the concept? I'm not sure if at times, kanji is better because it may indicate a clearer definition or meaning for some message that a foreigner is trying to give them.

1. I want to make a sign for students indicating ' BOOKBAGS HERE. ' or ' PERSONAL ITEMS HERE.' like this includes all bookbags, jackets, water bottles / juice bottles, snacks. Something should be added maybe, like 'Bags / etc MUST stay here '

2. NO CELL PHONES IN CLASS - TURN OFF AND USE AFTER CLASS or maybe that last part isn't necessary

3. PICK UP YOUR TRASH

4. DO NOT UNLOCK THE DOOR

5. DO NOT GO OUTSIDE THE CLASSROOM WITHOUT ASKING YOUR TEACHER

Do you guys think any of this is too hard to get the msg across to the students, who range from 5 yrs - 15??

I wonder if I should post all of it on a big paper saying ' Classroom Rules ' and go over it every day. It sounds so...I forget the word, something like presumptuous or pretentious, maybe it will make the kids feel like they are being be-littled BUT they need that discipline and classroom rules aren't even up anywhere in this classroom at least the one I taught this week. Maybe and hopefully it will be more in order when I go to my different school next week.

I can't blame my Japanese teacher for any of this, she's also fairly new ( just been here for 4 months ) and it's a new term so she has to learn the new students and their mannerisms, as well.

Linguistic Map of US and Canada dialects

Thu, 09 May 2013 23:06:02 GMT

Some of you might be interested in this map of all the dialect and language variations in the US and some in Canada. For my own area, it looks correct.

foreign accents

Thu, 09 May 2013 16:29:07 GMT

Hello to you, linguaphilies!

1 Which foreign accents in your native language sound most annoying to you?
And which are tolerable or even pleasant?

2. I've never been to any English-speaking country and, thinking about it, never communicated orally with a native English speaker.
So I've recorded myself reading a few sentences in English (the video is short really - 1.01 min). Would you watch it please and comment my accent? Does it sound unpleasant to you?
And can you tell from it what my native language is?

[video]

Please be polite but honest.
Thank you. )

where is it? vs. where is it at?

Thu, 09 May 2013 16:24:31 GMT

hello linguaphiles - I have a question for you.

Hopefully this hasn't been posted here before; if so, please direct me to the entry!

We all know that you're not supposed to end a sentence with a preposition, and that in "proper" English, you're supposed to ask where something or someone is, not where something or someone is at. I noticed that sometimes I use the latter phrase and for a long time chalked it up to growing up in Appalachia, but then I began to notice that I actually don't use these interchangeably; in my mind, they mean slightly different things.

So my question to you is: am I just weird, or do other people make this distinction as well? I think sometimes these phrases are certainly used synonymously, but has anyone else here used them or heard them used to mean specific and different things?

So for example:

Where is Jillian?
and
Where is Jillian at?

Do these mean the same thing to you, or not? If not, what is the distinction? I'll wait to reveal how I use them until I've heard from some of you ... :)

French homework help

Thu, 09 May 2013 11:31:36 GMT

Hello,

I was wondering if anyone out there would be so kind as to proofread this for me and point out any mistakes:

"En général, j’aime tous les arts. J’aime de la musique. Je ne joue pas d'instruments, mais quand j'étais enfant je voulais jouer du piano et du violon. J'adore la musique classique. Je n'aime pas beaucoup des concerts. Je déteste la foule. Je préfère les concerts de musique classique, des DVD ou mon iPod.

J'aime aussi regarder des films. Je vais au cinéma chaque fois que je peux. J'aime bien la comédie, mais je préfère le mélange de comédie et de drame.

Une autre chose que j'aime faire est aller aux musées et visiter des galeries d'art. J'aime bien la sculpture, mais je préfère la peinture et le dessin. Je veux aller au Museum of Modern Art (MoMA) et regarder "La Nuit étoilée". C'est ma peinture favorite.

Aussi, j'aime beaucoup les comics. Mes préférés sont les japonais, belges, américains et les français.
En plus, j'aime un peu le sport. Je ne joue pas des sports, mais parfois je joue du ping-pong avec mes sœurs bien que je suis très mauvaise. J'aime beaucoup regarder le football, surtout les matches du Real Madrid."

Thank you in advance.

false cognates poem

Tue, 07 May 2013 06:47:00 GMT

I forgot what I red long time ago. It was something like:

"my insoles began debate
how to better insolate"

And tell me please what is the right name of such wordplay
UpD reading wiki , no idea

upD2 with a proper metre, may be there was "the insoles debate ... to insolate", but it doesn't matter. It was like a poem (I don't remember too) about mistakes in English

a few questions

Mon, 06 May 2013 17:35:46 GMT

Hi all,

I wanted to convey this idea today and had no clue how to piece the sentence parts properly...

So someone asked me 'now what will you do? Or later, what will you do?'

Since I am 会話学校で英語教師をしてい, ( is that right? The word 'keiwa' meaning a conversational school?' in Japan?
I wanted to say 'I am going to plan for my classes tomorrow.'

How would I say something like that?

Also, how would I say that I need to leave somewhere early because I have to teach?

I just don't want to be rude and I wwant to make sure I keep in accordance with Japanese polite etiquette. I have to teach at a daycare Wednesday morning, and usually they want us to stay for an extra hour afterwards, i guess like drinking tea, eating snacks with the kids. I would rather get to my 2nd school as soon as I can, since I've got four classes to teach there back to back and prepare for!

What is the best thing to say?

Maybe 'sorry, maybe next week, but today I have to teach a lot' something like that?

Thanks guys! I really don't want to make any people upset and I have to make sure I'm polite etc, no matter what...it's so hard knowing the rules to this when you're in a new country...

Yet another article on the benefits of multilingualism

Sun, 05 May 2013 12:50:05 GMT

I love articles like these :)

http://healthland.time.com/2013/04/23/bilingualism/

Ancient Greek help

Sat, 04 May 2013 14:40:23 GMT

Hello everyone,
I'm looking for good resources on New Ionic. I've seen several lists of differences between the Ionic and Attic dialects, but I'm looking for something (a list, a book, a website...) that discusses New Ionic specifically.
Thanks!

some esssential 'home' items in Japanese

Fri, 03 May 2013 16:46:42 GMT

Hi all,

So having moved to my new apartment here in Japan, I'd love to hear your advice or thoughts on what are some essential items I should know how to say. I'm not sure how to ask for these items because I've either heard different words for it, or I just don't know haha.

~ How would I say room-spray, or fragrance for my room?
~ How would i ask for a small bookshelf, or bookcase to place books?
~ Is there a special word for slippers you wear inside the house and bedroom, vs. 'kutsu' the shoes you wear outdoors?

Domo arigato =)